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Japanese Plum Scions at Scion Exchange?
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greenthumb1981
12 Posts
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1
February 12, 2010 - 5:37 pm

Are there usually Japanese plum scions? My goal is to have a 3-1 or 4-1 combo. So, If I bring in a well-branched bare-root or potted tree, would someone there be willing to graft the scions to it?

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John S
PDX OR
2823 Posts
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2
February 12, 2010 - 11:16 pm

There usually are Japanese plum scions. I have grafted some and I'm thinking of bringing some too.
John S
PDX OR

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gponder
39 Posts
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3
February 13, 2010 - 9:38 am

Collect the wood very soon. Ours is starting to bud out!

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Viron
1400 Posts
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4
February 13, 2010 - 7:33 pm

Greenthumb – good question and great idea. You’ll have your base plum tree (a Satsuma, Shiro or Santa Rosa would be a good choice) and it will need several balanced, or well placed limbs; assuming one will be left for ‘it’s’ variety. I’ve always found a good selection of ‘Asian’ plum scions …though, to me, our scion supply is thinning… But I wanted a specific variety (or ‘cultivar’) last year, and found it!

Keep pollination in mind, an ‘extended harvest’ is desirable, but bloom time will still vary – even on the same tree. I’ve had an impossible time finding a pollinator for one of my Asian’s, blooms too late – and was interbred with too many relatives (thanks Mr. Burbank). So have a plan, cuz whomever does the grafting will have their hands full.

Planning to be there, I’d love that challenge. Keep in mind, they’ll have to charge you per graft (to keep it fair). Also, please grab scions as close to the diameter of your limbs as possible. You may even decide which limb gets which scion due to the availability of matching diameters. We can do small to large, reluctantly; but large to small is iffy and ugly…

Keep in mind, most multi-grafted fruit trees are Budded, giving them a very stable limb attachment. A whip & tongue will eventually form a strong bond, too, but it’s not the way it’s usually done. …in fact, you might simply look for a ‘store bought’ tree with some (hopefully researched) complimentary varieties already attached…

If you still want em put on the hard way, see me (or Shaun <img decoding=" title="Laughing" /> ) – sounds like fun!

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jafarj
422 Posts
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5
February 13, 2010 - 9:03 pm

John, what varieties are you thinking about bringing?

I have a tree with Howard's Miracle and Beauty which I'd never tried before. The couple of fruit I got last year didn't have any flavor so I'm looking for another variety or two to change it to.

Friends have Shiro so I don't need that.

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John S
PDX OR
2823 Posts
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6
February 13, 2010 - 9:49 pm

I'm thinking about bringing Santa Rosa and one that I think is Hollywood-a red/purple leafted plum. I like both and they pollinate each other and Santa Rosa is about done with fruiting when Hollywood is starting.
John S
PDX OR

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greenthumb1981
12 Posts
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7
February 18, 2010 - 8:39 am

Viron,
I now have my base plum trees, two for less than the price of one. Both are combo trees but have Stanley and Italian whips that should be just the right size for grafting and which I don't need. What time(s) are you going to at the exchange?
John, aka greenthumb

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Viron
1400 Posts
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8
February 18, 2010 - 7:02 pm

…I’m confused, thought you were planning on Asian plums, not European’s, like Stanley and Italian :?

Are both your ‘base trees’ European plums (or “prunes”)? I’ve been told Asian plums graft to European stock, but the other way around is short lived. Personally, I wouldn’t mix the two.

If all’s well, I plan to be at the event for the duration, they line up early!

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greenthumb1981
12 Posts
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9
February 18, 2010 - 9:51 pm

Viron,
One tree has two Japanese and two European; the other has three Japanese and two European. I have no idea why the grower grafted them that way. I would like to graft two more Japanese to each tree in place of the European. Should I plan on arriving at early or later when there might be less people?

John

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Viron
1400 Posts
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10
February 19, 2010 - 6:30 am

[quote="greenthumb1981":1v7miqea]
One tree has two Japanese and two European; the other has three Japanese and two European. [/quote:1v7miqea]
I suspect the ‘base trees’ are European, as I’ve been told, that’s the most long-lived combo. Keep in mind, you’ll need two Euro varieties to pollinate each other; I’m not sure if the bloom time will overlap between one remaining Euro and the Asians…

Too early to the show and not all the scions have shown up yet; too late and the woods gone/been picked over. Any time in the middle it gets pretty competitive (crazy :roll: ) and the lines for grafting can get fairly long. Last year ‘our guys’ shown up near the end …though I was dragging… it worked. We even had some time to visit, in person!

So make sure the Euros grafts you leave are compatible pollination wise, and again, finding some wood (scions) the diameter of the limbs you’d like grafted over would be very helpful. Otherwise, here it is: http://www.homeorchardsociety.org/scion_exchange/

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gkowen
Rochester, WA
218 Posts
(Offline)
11
February 19, 2010 - 7:58 am

Viron,

I am just thinking out loud here. If the base tree is European and the limbs are Asian, isn't it likely that the Asian plums were budded onto the European. If that is the case, the grafting he plans to do would put European onto the Asian limb. So wouldn't you still have the possible short lived scenario you mentioned? I don't know anything about plum compatibility. As I said, just thinking out loud here to learn more. Thanks.

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PlumFun
495 Posts
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12
February 19, 2010 - 8:07 am

Gkowen, you are correct if the rootstock is domestica.

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greenthumb1981
12 Posts
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13
February 19, 2010 - 8:53 am

Viron,
Ok, now I am thoroughly confused. All the varieties are bud-grafted on a base tree. What the base tree is I do not know, may be able to find out if necessary. I do not want any European plums, so can't Japanese varieties be grafted onto the European varieties close to the trunk? If the grafts are successful, that would leave 4 on one tree and 5 on the other; all Japanese.

John

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Viron
1400 Posts
(Offline)
14
February 19, 2010 - 7:42 pm

[quote="greenthumb1981":x6zi3zl0] Ok, now I am thoroughly confused. All the varieties are bud-grafted on a base tree. What the base tree is I do not know, may be able to find out if necessary. I do not want any European plums, so can't Japanese varieties be grafted onto the European varieties close to the trunk? If the grafts are successful, that would leave 4 on one tree and 5 on the other; all Japanese.

John[/quote:x6zi3zl0]
Isn’t this a blast :mrgreen: I’m virtually sure your base trees are European (domestica), otherwise the European stock would be as short-lived as has been described elsewhere around here -- and no credible nursery would make that mistake. I’m also ‘virtually sure’ the “Japanese” varieties were budded to the base European tree/s, as Greg suspects. Usually one limb (or bud) on the base tree is left alone to produce ‘it’s fruit,’ which would be one of the two Euro varieties you’ve described.

One of those Euros has been budded to the base tree as well, grafting onto it anywhere along that ‘limb’ would still give the Asian to Euro connection you want; and a pure Asian tree. Make sense <img decoding=" title="Wink" />

An aside, I speak of Asian plumbs as opposed to “Japanese” to give credit where ‘credit’s due,’ the Chinese did the bulk of the plum breading while the Japanese have apparently got the credit, much like ‘our own’ Luther Burbank – crossing long existing cultivars then claiming their fame…

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jafarj
422 Posts
(Offline)
15
February 21, 2010 - 12:29 am

I bought a 3 in 1 European plum from Raintree several years ago without questioning the rootstock. It turns out its on peach seedling.

I have no idea why they use peach for the combos but named rootstocks for their other plums

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PlumFun
495 Posts
(Offline)
16
February 21, 2010 - 8:04 am

[quote="jafarj":1jej1yv3]I bought a 3 in 1 European plum from Raintree several years ago without questioning the rootstock. It turns out its on peach seedling.

I have no idea why they use peach for the combos but named rootstocks for their other plums[/quote:1jej1yv3]
Probably different vendors to Raintree providing an acceptable, salable rootstock.

I used to graft on Myrobalan seedlings all the time. Good for single or multiple grafts. Not sure how domestica's would do on it long term though. You can use domestica seedlings for that.

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