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How are your grafts doing this year?
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DanielW
Clark County, WA
519 Posts
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May 26, 2016 - 8:16 am

I got several scions from the HOS propagation fair, plus a few from Fedco and a few around the yard.  Almost all were whip-and-tongue.   Some were species I've never tried grafting before.  Curious about how other's did and their experiences.

All of the apples took and are growing.  These are all on multigraft trees.  Newtown Pippin, Baldwin, Sweet-16, Milo Gibson, Arlie Red Flesh, Goldrush, Dolgo Crab, Hawkeye.  Of those, the slowest to take were Hawkeye and Dolgo Crab.

Graft Union, Airlie Red Flesh whip-and-tongue

Graft,  Airlie Red Flesh

I was concerned a couple of others would not take, because the sccions looked dry.  Those were Nikiseiki Asian Pear and Washington Red Plum, but they are growing as well as the apples.

I added a male fuzzy kiwi to my 3 year old unknown variety.  The scion was very soft and brittle, oozing sap and soft pith center.  My technique is not very fine, and I needed several attemps, shortening the scion each time.   It surprised me, but it took.   I also grafted some male hardy kiwi onto my Ken's Red hardy kiwi but the scion might be upside down.  I was unclear on the correct orientation.  So even though it is growing, the scion might be rejected or stunted .

Graft, fuzzy kiwi

Graft hardy kiwi male on Ken's Red.

I also added a Chocolate Persimmon to my Saijo.  I kept the  scion in the fridge until the understock was leafing out well, and protected the graft from sunshine with foil until the weather turned cooler again.  The buds look OK but are not leafing out yet.  I had cut the scion into two shorter peices and grafted both.  Only one has the buds so far.  I don't know if buds this small mean it really took.

From my own tree, I grafted scion from fig variety "Petite negri", onto a spare NOID tree that is more vigorous.  I have not grafted figs before.  Like the kiwi, the scion wood is soft with a softer pith.  The understock oozes latex when cut, which I thought might interfere with take.  I had the scion in the refrigerator for the winter, and there were no swelling buds.  Of three grafts, so far only one is showing signs of life, much behind all other fig growth.  Fig cuttings sometimes grow little new stems then die when the roots don't grow, but given the time outside, I think if this did not take there would be no  bud swelling at all.  This is on a "we'll see" status, I don't know yet if it really took.

I also tried some non-fruit trees, with less success.  Of the three male Ginkgo biloba that I grafted onto seedlings, they all looked like they took but then stalled and growth from understock took over.  I've trimmed back the understock growth and will see what they do.  One pink flowered NOID ornamental cherry on volunteer - probably sweet cherry - understock took, but the Kwanzan cherry did not take.

I wrapped all of mine with 1/2 inch vinyl grafting tape.  It was unseasonably warm at the time, so I also wrapped the entire length of the scion with 1/2 inch parafilm.  I could not find parafilm less than 1 inch, which is awkward, so I cut it in half to make the 1/2 inch.  I usually remove this when the growth is in the 1 to 2 foot tall range but not sure that is necessary.  I've had some tear through the wrap due to thickening stem at graft union, and some buds growh through the wrap.

I hope this is not too much for one post.  Curious about how other people's grafting turned out, and no one else around here is that interested in grafting or growing fruits.

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sweepbjames
NE Portland, OR Cully Neighborhood
231 Posts
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May 26, 2016 - 1:13 pm

Danial W wrote:       " I also grafted some male hardy kiwi onto my Ken's Red hardy kiwi but the scion might be upside down.  I was unclear on the correct orientation.  So even though it is growing, the scion might be rejected or stunted ."

While collecting scions for the propagation event, I had the opportunity to lose track of multiple grape, hardy and fuzzy kiwi orientation of collected material.   Redeemed my self esteem by closer examination to details on the branch, and it is consistent and only makes sense come to think of it, that,    the leaf scar will be below the bud.    This was certainly a revelation to me. I am not such a quick study.    Smile I guess you could say "buds up".

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jafar
763 Posts
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May 27, 2016 - 9:03 am

Daniel, that much bud swell does not necessarily mean it took, but is a very good sign. 

Your whip and tongue is textbook.  That's a very fine looking union.

LIke James mentioned, I look for the leaf axil scar for orientation on most scions.  I don't make an effort to store them in a particular orientation.  But kiwi are unusual,  it isn't so obvious as with apples and others.

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DanielW
Clark County, WA
519 Posts
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May 27, 2016 - 12:42 pm

For some reason, I thought kiwis were backwards compared to other plants, that maybe the growth bud was below the leaf scar.  Now I know that's wrong.  I'm pretty sure I did the fuzzy kiwi right, not as sure about the hardy kiwi.  If I remember correctly, the fuzzy is Blake which does not require pollination but does better with it, and ditto for the Ken's Red.  Either way, these are small and it will be years, I imagine, before any fruit.  If  ever.

 

Now I'm tending to take the apples and pears for granted, and focusing on the less typical fruits.  Still, as I walk around, I get excited at every one that is growing.  So grateful to HOS for the grafting class a few years ago, and for the propagation fair!

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John S
PDX OR
2800 Posts
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May 27, 2016 - 11:28 pm

Hey Daniel,

Nice photos.  Good work on the grafts.  I grafted some pine trees for the first time ever. They seem to have taken so far. I grafted Korean nut pine onto a different pine tree. 

Most of the pears and apples took, but not all.  Budding definitely works better with parafilm for me. Thanks Jafar.

This is the first year that I definitely have the problem that Jerry Shroyer has had for years: too many apples.  I can't believe how long it is taking me to bag them. I thin while I bag.  Save the broken branches.

I am switching over many quince trees to pear. It is working quite well.  

I always feel that kiwis look upside down if they are positioned correctly.  The hole by the leaf is pointed downward, which is the opposite of all other fruits.  I grafted them many years ago, but not at my new house of 7 years.

I haven't grafted figs, nor have I needed to. Nice work reporting on an uncommon practice. I look forward to hearing about it.

John S
PDX OR

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DanielW
Clark County, WA
519 Posts
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6
May 28, 2016 - 7:18 am

John, thanks for the comments and info.

What varieties of apples and pears did you graft?  It there a difference by variety in how fast they take off?

I've read about others grafting figs.  I don't think they have as vigorous camnium layer.  I did try whip grafts many years ago that grew for a while but never made a union.  They grow so easily from cuttings, it doesn't usually make sense to graft them.  I wanted to propagate this one, and the rootstock is extra and 3 years old, so I thought it might give me a head start.  This variety is not vigorous but is one of my favorites as far as the fruit goes.

Did your kiwis bear?  Fuzzy or hardy?

 

Daniel W

Battleground WA

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John S
PDX OR
2800 Posts
(Online)
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June 27, 2016 - 4:14 pm

I grafted more pears than apples this year.  My kiwis aren't flowering or bearing.  I haven't been focused on them. I grew them really well a few years ago when I focused on them, but whatever I pay attention to grows well. Unfortunately, the reverse is also true.

I grafted a lot of pears that I already had to free quince or hawthorn seedlings: Joanie's Favorite called Dana's Hovey, Passe Crassane, Obican VOdenac, El Dorado, abbe fetel, Johantorp.

Apples: Court pendu plat, knobbed russet, and the one I'm most excited about: Braddick's NOnpareil. It was the only one not related to orange pippin that was on Orange pippin's list of best 5 apples for flavor.

John S
PDX OR

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DanielW
Clark County, WA
519 Posts
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July 4, 2016 - 7:50 pm

John, sounds like some interesting apples and pears.  From what you described, my Hardy might not be upside down.  Or it might.  It is still on the branch with its one-inch growth, so who knows?

Deer ate half of the growth on my fuzzy kiwi male graft.  It is now fenced and starting to grow again.  Deer have really good sense of what interests me most, and that's what they usually go for.

Here are the Chocolate Persimmon grafts.  I cut the scion in half and grafted both halves.  The first to grow has odd color leaves.  I don't know what that means.  The other just started growing, which tells me to be patient.

Chocolate persimmon grafts, on Saijo.

chocolate persimmon graft

 

The fig graft looks good.  Not as much growth as the rest of the fig tree, but not dead either.  If I remember, I'll get a photo.

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John S
PDX OR
2800 Posts
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July 7, 2016 - 11:02 pm

Perhaps you can find a convenient source of nitrogen fertilizer for those yellowish leaves? 🙂

John S
PDX OR

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DanielW
Clark County, WA
519 Posts
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July 8, 2016 - 1:41 pm

John,

Laugh

As it happens, I do have a convenient source of nitrogen fertilizer!  I avoided using supplemental N on my larger persimmon trees this year.  The reason for avoiding more N was, I read that they drop their fruit if there is too much N.  Last year they set a couple but those fell off.  Maybe apply directly to the leaves? 

It's strange.  The leaves on the understock tree are dark green.  I don't think it lacks nitrogen.  Maybe Chocolate persimmon has leaves of a different color too?  Maybe the vascular system is not yet connected and the scion isn't getting enough nutrients?  I really don't know.

Really pleased these took, or maybe took.  I think next year will be when they take off.  Or die.

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John S
PDX OR
2800 Posts
(Online)
11
July 9, 2016 - 9:40 am

I often find that when I graft pear to quince, the new quince looks more yellow than the quince.  I "applied" my nitrogen fertilizer a lot this year. It is now regular green like the rest of the tree, and still chock full of fruit.  No more need for "applications". Now I'm off to a different tree.

A lot of trees flower one year, then get a few fruit the next, which often falls off, then gradually builds its ability to hold the fruit. I don't think we necessarily have to think of it as something we did wrong. I think the tree is building all the hormones, wood strength, xylem passageways, etc. What the tree is doing is really hard to do, and it is a natural development challenge for the tree.  The first time I learned to ride a bike I was excited; then I realized I didn't know how to stop.  That came later.  

John S
PDX OR

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DanielW
Clark County, WA
519 Posts
(Offline)
12
July 9, 2016 - 10:17 am

Your description may be why my pawpaws did not mature their fruit.  I'm frustrated, but we will see, again, next year.  If the persimmons fruit, I will be a happy boy.  I also have a Sweet Treat Pluerry that has only one fruit, in its second leaf.  Probably not mature enough.

I don't know what the "Red Washington Plum" was, that was at the scion show.  I split that into two scions and grafted them onto a Stanley plum, and both have grown to about 18 inches.  They will replace existing branches and provide pollination.  The pollination issue is a big reason I grafted this year, more than because I wanted more varieties.   Which was also true.

There was a big difference in growth for some scions.  Nijiseiki was very fast.  The unknown Asian pear that I grafted from my yard, only grew about half as long. 

Sweet 16 and Milo Gibson apples took but only grew a little.  Those were grafted onto a newly planted Winecrisp apple tree, from bare-root which might be why.  Newtown Pippin, Baldwin, Goldrush, Arie Red Flesh grew vigorously.  Those were grafted onto a more extablished but still young multigraft - actually, one I grafted at the HOS grafting workshop 2 years ago, I forgot to ask about the rootstock Cry.  Hawkeye took but barely grew.  Ditto for Dolgo crabapple.  Im still very happy about all of them.

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