Menu Close
Avatar
Log In
Please consider registering
Guest
Forum Scope






Start typing a member's name above and it will auto-complete

Match



Forum Options



Min search length: 3 characters / Max search length: 84 characters
Register Lost password?
sp_TopicIcon
Fall or Winter Fertilizing of Fruit Trees.
- Related Tags
Avatar
DanielW
Clark County, WA
519 Posts
(Offline)
1
November 14, 2015 - 10:53 am

Most of my trees are dropping their leaves, or about to.  I don't know what is the general consensus for fertilizing fruit trees this time of year.

Searching the internet, there are some recommendations for trees in general.

Fall Fertilization for Established Trees.  - "Contrary to traditional wisdom, many experts now consider late fall, or about a month after the first killing frost, to be the ideal time for applying fertilizers. "

Fall Fertilizing is Necessary and Extremely Beneficial...  this is in midwest.  "After fall fertilization, the trees are ready for the the spring growing season and will be much healthier looking."

Fertilizing Trees and Shrubs - "Late summer and early fall are the best times to fertilize shrubs and trees. At this point in the year, woody plants make the most efficient use of the fertilizer’s nutrients, which are absorbed when the roots are actively growing and shoot growth has ceased. Research has shown that early-spring growth depends almost exclusively on nutrients that were absorbed and stored the previous year."

Morton Arboretum - "If needed, the best time to fertilize is late April or early May, or late fall once plants are dormant. "

When To Fertilize Apple Trees.  "When additional nitrogen is needed, fertilize in fall, after harvest."

 

I don't claim to be an expert on fertilizing, but here are a few of my thoughts and experiences.

Some varieties are more subjected to fireblight if they have a burst of growth in the early spring.  Pears, Asian pears, apples, sourwood.  So I don't fertilize them now.  I wait until bloom time for the fruit trees, and spring for the specimen tree.

Some varieties are subjected to frost damage if they break bud early and grow too quickly, too early.  In my Battleground WA yard, that is figs and mulberries.  Grapes, too, but grapes should not get much nitrogen anyway because they put their energies into rank growth if too nitrogen rich.

Some trees respond really well to fertilizing, with much more growth than if I don't fertilize them.  That might help with growth in the first couple of years, especially.   Plums, small pawpaw, small persimmon, maples, cherries.  The negative with persimmons is, I read they drop fruit if they have excessive nitrogen.  Also CFRG.   ( If mature leaves are not deep green and shoot growth is less than a foot per year, apply a balanced fertilizer...)  I don't know if that is true for pawpaws.  So I would either cut back or stop nitrogen fertilizer when they are bearing size.   My Saijo also had early frost damage, so that too might be a reason not to fertilize in fall.  The precaution with sharing this info is my pawpaws and persimmons are very young, and I have yet to get fruit from them.  I want to boost the growth to inrease size more quickly.  The two larger pawpaws bloomed last year and have lots of buds now.  CFRG recomends fertilizing pawpaws twice a year.  I won't fertilize the larger of them now, thinking they do't need more vegetative growth and I don't want to jinx getting fruit if they do set.

I think if a tree is bearing size and putting out reasonable growth, I might not fertilize at all.   I want to keep my fruit trees smaller if I can, so once they are over 6 foot tall, if they look healthy and put out a foot or two of growth, I don't fertilize.

In 2013 I sent off soil sample for testing.  It showed that I don't need to add phosphorus or potassium, but was a little low in calcium and magnesium.  So I added lime and Epsom salts in moderate amounts.  I could have used dolomite lime but already had the regular lime and already had the Epsom salts. 

My grapes have sulked in the ground since planting them 2 years ago, so I will might them some nitrogen this winter for a boost in Spring.  My soil test did not reveal nitrogen amount, the company stated nitrogen is too transient and they provided recommendations based on estimated need.  Growth of weeds and grass in that area was poor, while areas that I fertilized grew very well, so I do think it's the nitrogen was low.  Maples and ginkgos are not fruit trees, but I want further rapid growth early next year, so they will get nitrogen boost this fall too.  With our dry summer climate, I want them to grow as well as possible before dry season sets in.

So that's my thought.  I think fall fertilizing is good for some varieties, or in some situations such as when trees starts are small and a boost of growth is wanted, but I would hold back if I think they are large enough, putting out enough growth already, or if fertilizing might contgribute to fruit drop, especially with bearing-age persimmons.

All experiences and comments are appreviated.  Is I stated, I am not expert.  There is considerable information on the web, but details are often lacking or there is conflicting advice, or the info is not specific for locations and species.

Avatar
John S
PDX OR
2823 Posts
(Offline)
2
November 16, 2015 - 9:11 pm

Hi Daniel,

In general I agree with you.  I don't fertilize, other than urine and compost. Trees that grow quickly are more subject to disease.  I do try to pee on the trees that look yellow. They turn green and then I share the wealth.  That seems to work well.

John S
PeeDX OR

Avatar
DanielW
Clark County, WA
519 Posts
(Offline)
3
November 17, 2015 - 6:28 am

John, according to my soil test, urine - urea nitrogen - should be all that is needed in my yard too.  Urine tests high nitrogen, NPK 11-1-2.5 sort of like fish emulsion NPK 5-2-2 or fish meal NPK 10-6-2, or bloodmeal NPK 12-0-0.  The young shade trees each get about a liter, diluted to a gallon and spread around the dripline.  Being rainy PNW, our salinity tested very low, so that is not an issue.

We were already high in potassium and phosphorus.  Calcium was borderline low, as was magnesium.  The soil was very acidic.  I have spread a dusting of wood ashes - for the alkalinity and calcium - but not much, because I dont want too much potassium.   Im drying some soil to send off another test now, we will see if there is any change.

Avatar
John S
PDX OR
2823 Posts
(Offline)
4
November 17, 2015 - 11:16 pm

I think in our typical PNW soils, wood ashes should be applied specifically to things that like them: lilacs, asparagus, cherries, a tiny amount to vegetables or apples, salad burnet, but never to blueberries, rhododendrons, or azaleas.

John S
PDX OR

Avatar
davem
357 Posts
(Offline)
5
November 19, 2015 - 10:17 am

I like to throw down a thin layer of fall lawn clippings (which includes both "browns", i.e. leaves, and "greens", i.e. grass).  After that I throw out some black oil sunflower seed.

The purpose of the sunflower seed is to attract wild birds.  The birds do several things:

  • Scratch through the leaf litter, looking for sunflower seeds.  They spend hours and hours doing this.
  • I am pretty sure that they eat insects and larvae that they find in the leaf litter and on the trunk & branches. e.g. coding moth.
  • Leave behind lots of droppings (i.e. organic fertilizer).

I put the seed out on a regular basis throughout the winter.  Even if the birds are not eating larvae, they are disturbing them, exposing them to the weather.

You can often find 40 pound bags of sunflower seed for $20, so this is a pretty cheap way to provide tree maintenance plus entertainment 🙂

Avatar
DanielW
Clark County, WA
519 Posts
(Offline)
6
November 19, 2015 - 5:28 pm

John, I think you are right.  

Wood ashes are very alkaline,

Dave M, that sounds like a great idea.  I feed the birds anyway.   One challenge for me - when I allow chickens in my orchard, they dig up the mulch thoroughly, which results in lush weed growth,  I imagine small birds would not do that.

Avatar
John S
PDX OR
2823 Posts
(Offline)
7
November 19, 2015 - 9:48 pm

Daniel, you could also make sure that your weeds are edible or useful to the orchard, like dandelion, sow thistle, plantain, spiny sow thistle, false dandelion, cress, and the feral vegetables I planted 15 years ago, like leeks, mustard and turnip greens,  parsley, curly mallow, scorzonera, horseradish, comfrey, and salad burnet.  I don't weed, I harvest.

John S
PDX OR

Avatar
thubten
11 Posts
(Offline)
8
November 22, 2015 - 8:34 am

Guys   I just received my soil test results from Logan Labs as well as one for a priest that I am helping to start a raspberry patch. However I couldn't tell from these reports what was high or low or how to amend.

I searched all over the internet to locate and interpret Logan Labs soil reports and got nowhere.

Help!

patrickConfused

Avatar
John S
PDX OR
2823 Posts
(Offline)
9
November 22, 2015 - 11:02 am

First of all, for calcium magnesium, and potassium, it shows a desired value.   Organic matter is optimally about 10% for a more northerly climate, say 6% for a more southerly one is more realistic.

I highly recommend Steve Solomon's "The Intelligent Gardener" for guidelines on how to aim for and calculate values, purchase appropriate amounts of fertilizer, and decide which portion to apply.

John S
PDX OR

Avatar
DanielW
Clark County, WA
519 Posts
(Offline)
10
November 22, 2015 - 11:20 am

Patrick, is your result posted here?  I can't see it  🙂

Avatar
thubten
11 Posts
(Offline)
11
November 22, 2015 - 12:17 pm

DanielW

Thank You  I will try to post it now.

Driscoll-Logan-Labs-Soil-Test-Rasberries.jpg

thank you

Avatar
John S
PDX OR
2823 Posts
(Offline)
12
November 22, 2015 - 8:31 pm

Your high calcium and low potassium are more typical of East of the cascades than WEst.  

John S
PDX OR 

Forum Timezone: America/Los_Angeles
All RSSShow Stats
Administrators:
Idyllwild
Moderators:
jafar
Marsha H
Viron
John S
Top Posters:
Rooney: 781
DanielW: 519
PlumFun: 495
Reinettes: 426
davem: 357
Dubyadee: 237
sweepbjames: 233
gkowen: 218
Larry_G: 187
quokka: 174
Newest Members:
Nanasi12
tritiumosu
osmogaia
BrandonS
brennele
yannick1107
larkiegarden
raryalvi@yahoo.com
lolilenon
Annabvak
Forum Stats:
Groups: 1
Forums: 4
Topics: 2903
Posts: 16717

 

Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 0
Members: 1403
Moderators: 4
Admins: 1
Most Users Ever Online: 232
Currently Online:
Guest(s) 19
Currently Browsing this Page:
2 Guest(s)