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Time for a new Grafting knife
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gkowen
Rochester, WA
218 Posts
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1
January 24, 2010 - 6:42 pm

What are your recommendations?

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gponder
39 Posts
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2
January 24, 2010 - 7:48 pm

The Tina 685 is my favorite. I've tried many grafting knives and this works the best for me.

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John S
PDX OR
3032 Posts
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3
January 24, 2010 - 8:09 pm

I got my last one when Big 5 sports had a sale, like a $65 knife for $9. It has worked great and unlike other knives, will take sharpening.
John S
PDX OR

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PlumFun
495 Posts
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4
January 24, 2010 - 8:10 pm

Stanley Utility knife. about $3

One blade can last all season and is reversible. New blades are as sharp as the dickens!

Done hundreds, maybe over a thousand using a Stanley.

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gkowen
Rochester, WA
218 Posts
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5
January 24, 2010 - 8:18 pm

I have heard of using the utility knives and tried it once. My experience was it wasn't very sharp. I couldn't even shave hair on my arm. I might have to check out the Big5 around here.

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Viron
1409 Posts
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6
January 25, 2010 - 7:04 am

Got mine over twenty years ago at a local farm store… “made in Japan,” but stainless steel and sharpened on both sides, to me, an excellent knife for under ten dollars, at the time. It’s also a rigid single blade, as opposed to a folding knife, with no budding protrusion.

Some tell me my knife’s ‘flawed’ because it’s sharpened on ‘both sides,’ it came that way. Many grafting knives are sharpened on only one side, and depending on ‘which side’ determines whether they’re “Left or Right handed” knives.

At our grafting classes (@CCC) a tray of one-sided rigid grafting knives are laid out for all comers. I have a very tricky time with them – the one-sided edges grab, making very drastic cuts, compared to my ‘normally’ sharpened knife which seems much easier to guide. After playing around, I begin to get the feel, but am plenty happy with my own… I think it depends on what you become used to.

If you end up in front of a display of the ‘best,’ I’d take in a couple apple shoots and ask if you can make a few cuts. If you do purchase a one-sided blade -- you’d better know which way it’s going to grab. And I wouldn’t count on any “advice” from the people behind the counter :roll:

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Marsha
204 Posts
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7
January 25, 2010 - 9:14 am

A short, thin utility knife blade is heavy enough? I figured I should have something I could get a couple of fingers on and lean on a little.

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PlumFun
495 Posts
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8
January 25, 2010 - 9:45 am

[quote="gkowen":1pvq5vpq]I have heard of using the utility knives and tried it once. My experience was it wasn't very sharp. I couldn't even shave hair on my arm. I might have to check out the Big5 around here.[/quote:1pvq5vpq]
I usually start out the season with a new blade in it. New blades seem razor sharp to me! I don't know if you have to shave hair with a knife in order to do good grafts though. Is your arm hair getting in the way? LOL

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PlumFun
495 Posts
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9
January 25, 2010 - 9:49 am

[quote="Marsha":1ive6uo4]A short, thin utility knife blade is heavy enough? I figured I should have something I could get a couple of fingers on and lean on a little.[/quote:1ive6uo4]
My whip&tongue grafts are done with the knife pulling towards my body. They are pretty sharp, and I have never had my fingers anywhere close to touching the blade -- the large handle of the knife is more than enough for transferring the force to the blade to the wood.

When used for bark grafting, it needs only to puncture the bark, then the bark peels back. Maybe a little force used for the puncture, but nothing extreme.

I swear, you could probly have a professional put a good edge on a butterknife and you could make decent grafts!

One need not have a $pendy knife to do grafting. Its a matter of preference, I think.

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gkowen
Rochester, WA
218 Posts
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10
January 25, 2010 - 10:18 am

I checked a few utility knives at work and all were dull. I found a pkg of new blades and put one of those in and I have a quarter sized area on my arm with no hair. It is extremely sharp. I will be taking that blade home tonight to see what it can do on my pruning pile. Thanks for the heads up. But that said, I also ordered a Tina grafting knife.

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Dubyadee
Puyallup, Washington, USA
248 Posts
(Offline)
11
January 26, 2010 - 6:27 pm

I agree with using the utility knife and its benefits:
- Blades are easily replaced with razor sharp new ones
- Large handle for good leverage/control when cutting your whips
- Easily retracted/extended blade for one hand opening when holding scion in the other hand. It's a good safety feature, you can extend and retract the blade every time so you aren't putting an open knife in your pocket or apron.

Stanley makes good sturdy replacement blades. Some of the cheaper utility knives like Allied have blades that aren't as stiff.

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John S
PDX OR
3032 Posts
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12
January 27, 2010 - 7:24 pm

That's a good point , Dubyadee. I stopped using them because the razor blade would bend.
John S
PDX OR

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Viron
1409 Posts
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13
January 29, 2010 - 9:31 am

I’ve played around making some cuts with utility knifes during our grafting classes, but didn’t care for them. The handles feel too fat and the blades too short. When I make a cut I often use the ‘full length’ of my grafting knife’s blade (nearly 2 inches). I’ll also rock that blade (working it toward me), or make sweeping slices… all moves a utility knife would be too stubby to perform.

It seemed I was forcing the utility knife more than what felt safe or comfortable, though literally sharp as a razor, there wasn’t enough blade to ‘feel or see’ while making cuts. The blade also lacked the rigidly of a grafting knife, which was another observation I’ve make regarding grafting knives - they’re rigid. Of the many classes of beginner grafters I’ve watched, their choice of knives still fascinates me. ‘Hollow ground’ pocket knives and thin bladed kitchen knives don’t work – well. The slightest blade flex leaves a ‘hollow’ cut, where a rigid blade leaves a level plane.

Another thing I like about my ‘full sized grafting knife blade’ is its length and strength when bark grafting or top-working. I can both pry back 3/8 to 1/2 inch bark without the blade snapping off, or tap the blade with a small hammer to split a small stock (including larger rootstock) for a cleft graft… Again, I like ‘seeing’ my blade, knowing where it’s at and having a lot of it to work with. [now don't read too much into that.. <img decoding=" title="Wink" /> ]

Keeping it sharp is can be tricky. Though the son of an old-school barber, I actually had to purchase a book on knife sharpening to finally learn the theory and procedure. In fact, if it’s still available, “The Razors Edge book of Sharpening” is fantastic. http://img.amazon.ca/images/I/5136GD0873L._SL500_AA240_.jpg 1985 by John Juranitch, Warner Books, Inc. I also recommend stainless steel blades, they’re much harder to work, but their edge lasts equivalently long. And they hold up to the disinfectants I use between grafting. I’m not trying to start a squabble …but when I eventually lose my single-blade grafting knife… I’ll replace it with another.

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gkowen
Rochester, WA
218 Posts
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14
January 29, 2010 - 12:46 pm

I found my 2 blade Victornox or whatever it is. Bought a new utility knife and blades. And decided to try a Tina knife so bought one of those. I think I am set for a while. I am trying to figure out something new to try though. I always have troubles with cutting the tongues. There has to be a 'better way' - for me at least. Now to the pruning pile this weekend to test and try and play... by the way, the book is still available.

http://www.amazon.com/Razor-Edge-Book-S ... 092&sr=8-4

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Viron
1409 Posts
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15
January 29, 2010 - 3:37 pm

Now doesn’t this have ya ready to graft? http://www.benmeadows.com/images/xl/Tina-General-Purpose-Grafting-BEN_i_bmw153624.jpg ..."this standard pattern knife is ideal for all general purpose grafting. The 2-1/2" sharp steel blade is attached to a 4" polished walnut handle that is perfectly shaped to fit the palm of your hand." Only $89… “sharp steel” – as opposed to stainless steel..? I’d watch that, though some manufactures have patented various names for their blend of stainless, I’d verify the stainless aspect.

I assumed the book was still around when I came up with a photo, there are apparently lots of them. I’ve loaned mine out twice, occasionally refer to it and obviously recommend it.

As far as cutting the tongues, I use both a rocking & dragging motion, coming toward myself across the scion face... I also position the scion to where ‘if it slips’ - it will dodge the ‘bulk’ of my thumb – though I’d likely lose my prints! …OK – knocked on wood – I’ve never cut myself in the grafting process… just become ‘one with the wood’ young grasshopper :mrgreen:

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PlumFun
495 Posts
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16
January 29, 2010 - 4:00 pm

[quote="Viron":luzrahu1]I’ve loaned mine out twice, occasionally refer to it and obviously recommend it.[/quote:luzrahu1]
Never loan out your chainsaw or wife. They come back running hot and leaking!

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Viron
1409 Posts
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17
January 29, 2010 - 4:46 pm

[quote="gkowen":1z50ara5] I always have troubles with cutting the tongues. There has to be a 'better way' - for me at least. [/quote:1z50ara5]

You’ve not been to our grafting classes, have you? We have available 4 X 4 inch X ¼ inch plywood squares with a half inch hole in their center. If you fear cutting yourself on the tongue cut – cause that’s where it’s gonna happen – you can stick the scion or rootstock up through the hole and make the tongue cuts above your other hand.

As safe as it is… I miss the control I feel doing it freehand, thus leave them. But they work!

[quote="plumfun":1z50ara5] Never loan out your chainsaw or wife. [/quote:1z50ara5]

That’s a definite on the chainsaw…

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gkowen
Rochester, WA
218 Posts
(Offline)
18
January 29, 2010 - 5:36 pm

It would be nice if the grafting classes were held on a day other than Saturday but that's the way it is. I ordered a much cheaper Tina knife than that. It supposedly is what the people at Raintree Nursery use. We will see.

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Marsha
204 Posts
(Offline)
19
January 29, 2010 - 8:26 pm

Viron, thank you for your post with the link to the book. You confirmed what my question only hinted at - how I might want to lean on a blade and how the knife balances and feels in the hand are important.

And I'm definitely going to check out that book. I can maintain an edge, but if I lose it, I can never quite get it back.

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Applenut
80 Posts
(Offline)
20
January 31, 2010 - 8:42 am

I vote for the Stanley utility knife (NOT the cheap knockoffs- they're dangerous, as the scar on my pinkie attests). I've done thousands of grafts with it, cleft, whip and tongue, budding, and chip grafts.

The Stanley's thin, stout blade makes a clean cut and can be changed instantly. The price is right, and the bright green handle makes it easy to find in my clutter.

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PlumFun
495 Posts
(Offline)
21
January 31, 2010 - 1:40 pm

I vote for the Stanley utility knife (NOT the cheap knockoffs- they're dangerous, as the scar on my pinkie attests). I've done thousands of grafts with it, cleft, whip and tongue, budding, and chip grafts.

The Stanley's thin, stout blade makes a clean cut and can be changed instantly. The price is right, and the bright green handle makes it easy to find in my clutter.
I vote for the Stanley utility knife (NOT the cheap knockoffs- they're dangerous, as the scar on my pinkie attests). I've done thousands of grafts with it, cleft, whip and tongue, budding, and chip grafts.

The Stanley's thin, stout blade makes a clean cut and can be changed instantly. The price is right, and the bright green handle makes it easy to find in my clutter.

Ya beat me to it, bro!

My handle is gray, but who cares. I'd go for a bright orange or red handle in a heartbeat. Maybe I should spray paint mine.

It was $2 on sale at ACE hardware one day! Included 5 replacement blades too! Whatadeal!

It's done hundreds if not thousands of grafts, just like you say!

LOLOL!

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Applenut
80 Posts
(Offline)
22
January 31, 2010 - 1:48 pm

Not to mention the 100-blade replacement pack (200 edges) is about 20 bucks. I also confess I use it for much more than grafting the rest of the year, something I'd NEVER do with my high-dollar TINA knife.

You can see me doing bud grafts with it at

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doogz
1 Posts
(Offline)
23
April 1, 2010 - 1:45 pm

[quote="gkowen":29m2ndvj]I have heard of using the utility knives and tried it once. My experience was it wasn't very sharp. I couldn't even shave hair on my arm. I might have to check out the Big5 around here.[/quote:29m2ndvj]

I have my utility knife but it's too sharp and I maintain the sharpness of it.

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