I read Viron's post a while back already and decided that one of the more newly developed plums that exceeded my expectations worth mentioning here is 'Owen T'. Which I got from the breeding station in Parlier CA 6-7 years ago. It just might be the one of the early blooming kinds that work there. It sets fruit all by itself and the fruits are half a pound. So the one tree investment and risk of any one kind of these, this might be it. I don't thin and it's able to size these incredible crops, though only every other year.

So Viron, as you have heard me list out on other topics before the inherent variations in all plants, Michael Pollan, etc. Well to add to his view and my own mounting evidence; Well I just returned from Edmonton. They can only grow smaller plums and apples. A few of those more educated in the sciences that are attending those northern versions of our scion swaps do have a few largely developed apples, so there are those few highly bred. So what's new is that people like the one recently retired from these breeding sciences that differ are some findings that seeds have been planted from markets of the jonagolds type of apples. The one case is proven that somebody planted a seedling apple which took 27 years to make the first flowers and fruit in 2018. The apples were large store sized apples that tasted similar to 'ambrosia'. 

Previous to that his other retired friend in Edmonton was also at the same meetings all the time had promoted the 'Evans' pie cherry from an Edmonton seedling that has histories going back the about 1930. Which starting in the 1990s made great profits to those that sold a simple seed discovery from the middle of a cereal province which to this date none have produced so ample as the evans. Later on the evans had in fact (personal conversations with the founder) started in Alberta by seed.

The notion here is that there can be another way of developing fruit to new sites other than selective breeding. It just takes as long as 27 years sometimes. While it's still cold out I'm going to the library to add a link to this post and PM both you my email progress report to the establishers of Owen T plum on my property as I think you could try the seeds and even "maybe" the mother plant is worth a shot going after too.

Further to my internal post-3, 2nd paragraph concerning plant variables: botanists hang onto the ways plants transition from juvenile and into adulthood as "plasticity", meaning of course the learning of how to adjust to the environment period. With mounting evidence of how many years this can take (ie ~25 yrs) one might think of it as an "internal evolution".

Apples have been tried in Edmonton as far as grafted from adult scions obtained from store bought cultivars such as the 'jonagolds'. Mostly they die out several years at most. They have ripened a honeycrisp last year due to the priorly unusual and long growing season. However it was only October. The 27 year old break-through store seedling is reported to ripen 4 weeks earlier. 

If I were a yougster I think that is the way I would establsh an orchard (by seed) in adversity (fireblight or otherwise) and let the mechanics that are already in place "evolve".

Just last week upon inspecting my first graft I ever made in my life of about 25 years ago, I found that the yellow cultivar of black-locust 'frisia' that I had grafted had taught the previously green-based roots to turn almost yellow, as evidenced by a recently formed root sucker with the new leaves being golden, an imitation. I suppose the day I chop of the frisia then the rest below would slowly reform back to green again. As the juvenile in my black-locust tree is mostly adult, the definition of "mentoring" does not necessarily follow the same meaning as juvenile "plasticity".